Drilling Philosophy 101

[Blind Squirrel]

Allrighty then,

This thread has taken a slightly different direction than I intended. The responses have been mostly debating different drilling techniques when what I really want to know is, who out there repairs chips without drilling? And, most important, how do you do it?

I had a great conversation with Brent yesterday and he enlightened me on how the seal configuration is the major factor is Delta's unique ability to accomplish this.

Don, you mentioned in one of your posts that your injectors, which is the same I use, can accomplish this but that you drilling is mostly for expediency.
This I have experimented with extensively and have ended up frustrated every time and just go back to aggressively drilling almost every chip.

It will be some time before I'm able to attend a Delta training, so for now I will order their training video, if Brent will sell it to me. I will purchase a Delta rig in a couple months and find out for myself and hopefully all will end well.

[gt_repair]

Brian
I have customers that are also in the aviation field and they kind of helped in my idea stoping the crack the way I do.

There is nothing technical about repairing windshields, just comnon sence and patiance to do a good job. What works for one break may not work for another.
Same for people.

[gt_repair]

The way I look at it, If I do not drill and there is an air pocket traped in the repair no mater how long or how much presure you put on the chip it will not fill, you can not drill through wet resin or be able to pop a chip to help. At least if I have a hole drilled and I do have a problem I can pop the hole to help out as my back up...

[Daveycrewcut]

As long as you are using a good UV screen, you can drill into the wet resin. I have done it many times and in fact when using the old diamond tipped drill bits it was always recommended to use a drop of resin for a lubricant. Unless the break is too small to manipulate with a probe, I usually try the repair without drilling & then if there is a problem filling a leg or two, I swivel the injector to the side and drill right into the wet resin. After the pilot hole is drilled, sometimes I angle the drill bit toward the leg that is not filling. That usually solves it.
Before drilling I always try loosening the injector in case too much pressure is closing the cracks. Sometimes that keeps me from having to drill.

[SGT]

Originally Posted by gt_repair

Brian
I have customers that are also in the aviation field and they kind of helped in my idea stoping the crack the way I do.

There is nothing technical about repairing windshields, just comnon sence and patiance to do a good job. What works for one break may not work for another.
Same for people.

Don,

I agree 100% patience and common sense are a big factors in windshield repair and may be the difference between a good repair and a great repair. I disagree to say that there is nothing technical about repairing windshields.

The reason, in aviation we can only drill a pilot hole is becuase the material, usually aluminum, titanium or polycarbonate, that is all you can do with it. It an acceptable means per the regulations but they are not considered perminate fixes and are continually inspected for progression, which usually happens. Now with glass with have the ability to stabilize it in a different manner by creating an anchor which provides a larger area for stress disapation, helps ensure the crack does not pass under, helps ensure the true end of the crack is stopped prevent the connect the dots effect and not drilling to the laminate

Your method is working for you and that is all that matters. I am not trying to convert you to my method of anchoring a crack, just wanted to give you a a little background why we can only drill a pilot hole in aviation and the factors to why I drill hole that does not go to the laminate and create an anchor.


Gary,

You seem very curious as to not drilling repairs. Reach out and give me a call if you want to talk. I will help you as mush as I can over the phone.

[jayjacque]

What'd I miss? Didn't check the board for a couple days and whoah look what happens!

Ok on the subject of to drill or not to drill. I've tried going off drilling, but there is one common type of repair that always seems to need it, that's those batwings that are located deep enough that they won't fill or only half fill unless drilled or at least popped. And I get a lot of them. Do you non-drillers pop those or claim that they just fill given extra time?

[screenman]

Another alternative to drilling is one I use, that is to open up the damage by tapping into the centre quite hard using my carbide tipped scribe and another probe to whack it. Now this work well for me on those damages that maybe I should have drilled and did not, only to find halfway through they are not filling. I would not advise this course of action unless you are absolutely sure of your ability to get it right and you must wear eye protection, which of course we should all be wearing anyway.

[glassfixerCO]

I've also found it helps speed up the process to drill first on just about every type of chip except nice round bullseyes. Like Blind Squirrel, I live in the Denver area. I wonder if the high altitude here may have something to do with it [bracing myself for sarcastic replies].

[Brent Deines]

Originally Posted by jayjacque

What'd I miss? Didn't check the board for a couple days and whoah look what happens!

Ok on the subject of to drill or not to drill. I've tried going off drilling, but there is one common type of repair that always seems to need it, that's those batwings that are located deep enough that they won't fill or only half fill unless drilled or at least popped. And I get a lot of them. Do you non-drillers pop those or claim that they just fill given extra time?

I don't drill and I don't pop, and yes, I'm saying that even those with batwings fill completely. As I have stated before, the extra time is very minimal, usually 5 minutes or less.

I'm blown away by this tread! I knew that some people drilled, but I had no idea that so many did, including some Delta Kits customers which bothers me more than anything else. I can't speak for anyone else, but I can say that beyond the shadow of a doubt Delta Kits users do not need to drill except in rare instances (less than 1% of the time). Some have stated that they don't "need" to drill, but simply choose to, but it sounds to me like many of you need to drill in order to get the break to fill properly in a reasonable period of time, especially on tight breaks. Depending on the system you use, that should not be the case.

So what is a reasonable amount of time? Rather than put a time limit on a windshield repair job I will work on a break until I believe it is filled properly. Admittedly I spend more time than some, but I can generally complete a repair in less than 20 minutes, very rarely take more than 1/2 hour, and in some cases finish in less than 15 minutes. To those of you that put a 10 or 15 minute time limit on your repairs I suppose my times are unexceptable, but it doesn't sound like my times are that much different than most of the drillers.

So if I can fill the repair in the same amount of time, and get the same or better quality without drilling, why would I "choose" to drill. Even if you claim your drilled repairs look just as good as non-drilled repairs, there is still an expense involved. I just don't get it. However, I do sell burs, so please don't let me discourage any of you drillers from continuing to use your current method of repairing windshields.

I had planned to quit posting on this thread, but the word "claim" got my intention. I don't claim that I drill less than 100 repairs, including tight stars, bat wings, etc., that is an undeniable fact. We often have very tight star breaks to work on in our training classes and even our first time students can fill them without drilling. It's not big deal.

We have taught the no drilling technique for at least 10 years now, and have found very few technicians who cannot master it. I will say however, that experienced technicians have hardest time with it as they try to apply their own techniques to our system. I've tried my techniques with dozens of other systems, and it just doesn't work, can't or won't make the change.

I also understand that some people are very happy drilling every repair, and therefore see no reason to change. That's OK with me too, I just don't like the fact that some people are taught that drilling is necessary, especially when it is presented that way on the windshield repair forum.

Drilling is an alternate method that some prefer. I will probably never understand the reasoning behind that, but I can accept it as long as the drillers can accept the fact that not drilling is also an alternate method. Which method is better will have to be left up to the individual technician, and of course those who supply their equipment, and those who supply their training.

[gt_repair]

See Brent, You can write the book on doing repairs and they still read what they want to from it... and do what they want.

The old saying go's: You can lead a horse to water, but you can not make them drink..... They have a mind of their own...