Rain X treated windshields

[SGT]

I do not want to get into whos system is better as I think everyone knows how I feel. So to answer your question of how to deal with Rain X, I will speak to my experience.

If you are not sure if Rain X is present you can ask the customer if they use hydrophobic coatings on there windshield or if they go through car washes, you can check by spraying water on the windshield and see if there is a very tight groupinig of water beads or you can take no chances and just use steel wool as mentioned by Brent around they chip.

So what to do if there is evidence of a hydrophobic coating, well if your not a believer of introducing more moisture into the break from one of the marketed products out there and you do not want to comprimise the PVB with alcohol or other evaporative product then this is what I do. I would like to say this is another tip from a wise man named Brent. You can use your moisture evaporator. Yes that is right another use for that tool. Use it the same way as intended for moisture. It appears that the intense heat breaks down the substance. Now I have no scientific data to provide you but I have been doing this since I was informed of this and I have had a problem to date.

Hope that helps.

[screenman]

That would certainly be the reason I do not ever get any problems with the product if that is the case, as I dry out every single repair I look at.

[Brent Deines]

Brent

Why is it every thing that does not sound right by your terms tend to be ether the equipment or training?

What would you say if someone had your system and resin and was trained by you personally. Would this make your system, resin and training inferior?

Now, I will say I do not use your system, resin or was not trained by you at all. I have been well trained and not by a video. So does this make me a bad tech with a bad system?

I have been at this to long with one of the top systems and resins and training also. Seems just because you have not encountered this in your time does not mean it has not been done....

Here is your homework assignment again if you do not mind.
Take the rain-X and apply it like Frank said as a bad application by letting it drop in a break, let it dry for some time by aging it for a week. Now proceed to do your repair.
We will then see what you have to say about rain-X.

Sorry but you hit a nerve thinking you and your system is by far better than others on the market. Yes there are far worst systems out there but you are always knocking everyone or their system they use...

I know it is your site again

Wow, I guess I did strike a nerve. Sorry about that! My point was simply that I cannot speak to you or anyone else but Delta Kits users on this issue because it has never been a problem for me, and I don't want Delta Kits users to get nervous about something that has never been a reported issue. Being a Rain-x user myself for several years years, having been a windshield repair technician for 22 years, and having the unique opportunity to talk to thousands of windshield repair technicians around the world, you are the very first person to ever report this problem. Does that mean it has never happened to a Delta Kits technician? I cannot say that for sure, but I can say it has never been reported by anyone using our equipment and following our procedures, therefore I logically conclude that it may have something to do with equipment and/or technique. You are the one having the problem, but you don't seem to want to listen to all the possible solutions. When I have a problem that is repeatable I am wide open to suggestion, and will try any test I can to try to solve the problem.

Now as to my homework assignment. I have done the test just as you instructed, with one exception. Knowing that the break, a bullseye, was full of a fluid, I naturally used my moisture evaporator. There was slightly more reaction than when removing straight water, but the Rain-X was gone in 20 seconds. I allowed the glass to cool to ambient temperature and filled the break with resin, ran through the pressure and vacuum cycles just as with any other break, and guess what, the break filled just like any other break.

I should point out that unless you were to repair a break within minutes of improperly applying Rain-X, most of the fluid would have evaporated as it has a very high alcohol content, which would explain why I never had the weird sputtering reaction when using the moisture evaporator in the past, except when we have run the very same test, which by the way, we have on several occasions.

Something else interesting was that the moisture evaporator also seemed to remove the Rain-X from the surface of the glass. We have noted this before in previous testing, but with only a handful of tests to go by we still recommend using 0000 steel wool or Cerium Oxide to remove the Rain-X prior to starting the repair, but I was pretty certain it would work so I gave it a shot, and low and behold it did work.

As for me thinking that Delta Kits sells a far better system than anyone else, if I thought otherwise I would go to work for the someone else. Of course I think our system and techniques are the best, just as apparently you do. What's wrong with that? However, I did not say you are a bad technician, nor did I say your equipment was not any good. All I said was that it has never been a problem for me and as far as I know it has never been a problem for a properly trained Delta Kits user.

Again, I'm sorry I got you all worked up. When I post an answer to a question on this board I am primarily speaking to Delta Kits users, but if my experience is different than yours I am going to post it, just as you are going to post your experience if it is different than mine. It's okay to disagree on this board, so please don't expect me to agree with everything you say. Take a deep breath and have a great weekend. Life is too short to get all worked up over a post on a forum, unless of course it's your job.

[Chips be-gone]

Brent
Lets take it back a few years ago before most of us had the web and free at our finger tips. Not knowing what the dryout moisture evaporator was, if it was even out back then, what would you have done at that point.
You see, I am taking it back that far and it has been that long scene I encountered this reaction . I been at this for 18 or so years also and only had the forums the last 5 or 6 years.
With the info of other techs, things are a lot different with knowledge. Even a greenhorn or newbie can learn more in 3 months than what we all took trial and airier or winging it for a year or more. Again things are totally different.

Like you said: Knowing that the break, a bullseye, was full of a fluid, I naturally used my moisture evaporator.
Some do not know how to tell if the glass is coated or not. Her they are learning how to tell.
The tools are there to use. Back then I do not think the dryout moisture evaporator was or was not promoted with this as a use..
We only relied on flyers if we were on a mailing list.

Sometimes we need to remember how hard or different it was for use to learn this trade.

[Brent Deines]

I agree with you 100%, it was very different in the old days. Still, I have always dried out my repairs if there was water in them, and I was taught very early in my career that if I was not sure if the break contained moisture I needed to make sure before proceeding. As screenman says, "when in doubt, dry it out". Back then we used torches and heat guns to dry out repairs. I also learned to test for Rain-x early because I used the product myself and realized right away that it could cause the resin not to stick to the surface of the glass. I have to admit though, I have gotten in a hurry and forgotten to check on more than one occasion, the most memorable being when doing a demonstration in front of about 50 glass shop owners and several employees of one of our largest distributors. As luck would have it I was using a new repair system rather than my working system so I had nothing but pit polish to remove the Rain-x with. It worked, but it took a lot of scrubbing and I looked like a fool. I was hoping I would forget that nightmare, thanks for making me relive it! Just kidding.

You mentioned that they used resin to remove Rain-x, and I said I have not found that to work very well, however most resins contain acid, and the right type of acid in the right concentration will definitely take Rain-x off glass. There is a water spot remover that is an acid based product that will take it right off, and even some industrial toilet bowl cleaners, etc. will take it off, so it is possible that some resins with a high acid content will also do the job. Just wanted to throw that in since I have been so argumentative lately. I should have said Delta Kits resins are not very effective at removing Rain-x due to the low acid content. We don't use resins with a high acid content as they can be pretty harsh on the skin and are getting difficult to ship. I don't like using other high acid products for the same reason, but that is personal preference I suppose. If you say your resin takes Rain-x off the surface I will take your word for it. Sorry I did not state my original rebuttal more accurately.

[bmccastro]

Thank you for your help. I did do a search before I posted my question. I posted it because beside getting the area really clean it didn't seem like anyone was really sure, there was the alchol idea and someone else said no not a good idea. The only idea that most agreed with was the woolpad idea. The only reason I'm not too keen on that is fear that I'll get some steel wool in the break.

I did find some stuff online I'll get the info on it and post it.

I'll also fill out my profile.

Thanks again

Juan

[doctor ding]

The only problem(s) I've had with either Rain-X or wax is that the pit filler sticks to the curing tab and pulls out of the pit and away from the surrounding glass when I remove the tab. Although It's a pain in the ***, I just refill and retab about two or three times until the pit filler sticks.

[J.T.Window]

This is what I meant when I said the curing tab pulls the cured resin out of the pit. If that happens you can usually scrub the surrounding one square inch with wet resin and a paper towel and cure just one more time.

[engineer]

Brent,

I have a question regarding your homework assignment. You stated that you used your Drystar as you knew the break was full of fluid. I am confused. If you allowed the Rain-X to cure for the 1 week period that was described in your homework assignment how would there be any fluid left especially since Rain-X is primarily alcohol-based therefore volatile? You also mentioned that there was slightly more of a reaction (sputtering) when you dried the break and that you have seen this in the past when attempting a repair within minutes of improperly applying Rain-X. Not trying to pile on here or anything but I am naturally curious what your experience would be if you actually allowed the Rain-X treatment to age for the one week period that was suggested.

Sincerely,
Allen

[sunshine wr]

Rain-X and other products like it are silica based, and nothing sticks to silicone. Baking it with heat sounds like a good idea.