The Evil Farmers/Geico Empire(s)

[Mr. Chips]

I have been doing a lot of reading on the posts and have seen where many of you have had difficulties with Farmers (mostly) and Geico.

I havn't started business yet, but as I read about these problems, particularly with Farmers, several thoughts ocurred to me. On the surface, it would seem the best alternative with these problematic companies is to simply avoid the claim altogether and require cash up front. But this presents another problem in that you are offering a service, claiming it to be free, then telling your customer that it's only free after they pay you first and submit an invoice themselves and pray for payment. Doesn't sound like a good way to build customer confidence. So then I got to thinking about reasonable alternatives.

My question is, do any of you see a reduction in these problems by using full-service A.C.T. as opposed to through the networks? Seems to me that if A.C.T. is providing the full service, companies that like to use "steer tactics" aren't given the chance because they aren't speaking directly to the insured.

I like to pocket as much cash as the next guy, but if many of these problems can be minimized by simply utilizing A.C.T., it seems like $$$ well spent, and you are able to maintain professional integrity with your customer.

I have one final question. Is anyone aware of customers that were given a rate increase as a result of your work?

Appreciate any discussion.

C. Holton

[GlassStarz]

I use act and have had no problem with either. I do several geico claims a week and the occasional farmers

[JBD3101]

ive been told by my employers that you can claim unlimited repairs with no increase in ins. please let me know if u find out different. bridget

[GlassStarz]

I think the hype is overblown the so called attempts at steering are generaly the rep asking the question "Mr customer with the glass coverage you have you also have the option of replacement should you wish. do you choose repair ?" Dude if you cant overcome any questions the customer comes up with after that you need to find another job.
I dont even consider that steering just the insurance company making thier customer aware of all thier options get over it. The folks at the fast food fat people factorys allways ask if you want fries with that or does ya wanna be extra plump and SUPER SIZE it? hate it when they try to steer me! of course I dont eat that slop and thats why I look so good ;&)
My advice to the They Steer People! complainers is SALESMANSHIP! this job is a sales job not a repair job! be strong and sell something come up with answers and get sales dont whine about the ones you miss.
A weak saleperson comes up with excuses a strong one overcomes objections plain and simple heck if your so worried about steering start the repair before you put em on the phone and if one gets turned down who cares?

[Jeremiahswindshieldrepair]

Glassstarz, while I agree with you on the salesmanship thing, it is VERY true that Farmers tries to steer and they are totally incompetent as well. A couple examples I have witnessed .... "if you don't use a Safelite approved company we can't guarantee your rates won't increase." "We can have a Safelite approved company come right to your door tomorrow and get it fixed... that way you have a full warranty and your rates will not increase by another company overcharging for the repair." "They are not one of our preffered shops and therefore we can't guarantee quality or price, if there is any charge we don't pay you will be responsible for it."

They also are about 40% of our billing problems. We EDI our invoices to them and about 40% of the time they claim they never recieved them but they got others out of the same batch we sent. They try to make it so difficult for people that they just give up and move on. Besides that, like they told me on the phone, they have enough lawyers to handle it if I sue them. They can and will drag out a lawsuit for years and years and there is no way a small guy like me can stop them so essentially they can do what they want.

Geico just sucks because they use the word "CLAIM" several times which always makes people very nervous. State Farm does not do that and they are awesome.

[maxryde]

Jerimiah, You said it man. Salesmanship to a point and prepare your customer then start to work WHILE they process the claim!! You can tell if a customer is fully covered by their demeaner, vehicle age, value.. Oh and I use the A.C.T. program too and if you don't prequalify they (A.C.T.) will put the kabosh on the steering issue if the processer attempts to go there!!! Scott

[ARG]

Glassstarz:

I agree with you about the part of selling, what I call prepping the customer, and that they have a right to offer a windshield replacement. However I must say Farmers is not a company in favor of windshield repair. They appear to me to be anti-small business.

First off the contract I have with Safelite states I must guarantee the work and that I cannot charge more than what the insurance companies pay. I have been on their list for years; yet I have had times in which they tell the customer, we are not on the list and that they may have additional charges if they use us. Further that they may not have a guarantee by using us. It may be different in Vermont, but I can tell you in Oklahoma, Farmers' sucks. They are the total opposite of companies like State Farm, Allstate, Ohio Casualty and Oklahoma Farm Bureau to name a few. We use ACT and they do a great job, but even with them Safelite attempts to steer at times.

While Farmers has sent out letters to their insureds to get their windshields repaired, we have found most Farmers agents have nothing good to say about windshield repair. I have often wondered why, until recently. I talked to a retired Farmers' adjuster, he told me the reason for the negative attitude is money driven. Their agents get bonuses for renewals. If an insured files a claim of any type, in their eyes they may face a rate increase or cancellation. In the event of a rate increase, the insured may go to a different insurance company. In either case they lose their bonus.

If Farmers' is fair, explain why when you go to their website to search for windshield repair or replacement, you get one choice, Safelite. Here in central Oklahoma, you can type in any zip code and you get one vendor Safelite. Looking at their site it states their preferred vendor is Safelite, not Safelite network or shops working for their network.

If Farmers' and Safelite are fair, then why after I've done a repair, do they call my customer and offer to waive the deductible for a free replacement. Something that wasn't on the table before the repair was made. Further followed by the agent telling the customer that if he does not get the replacement, that he may not get anymore replacements paid for by Farmers'.

One must question if the system is fair, Safelite makes their own glass, the 800 number goes straight to them, and they have the largest chain of stores.

If this so called "steering" is just a bunch of cry babies and a lack of salemanship, I suggest you look at what the IGA and Diamond Triumph have stated as to why they are headed to court. I wish them both the best of luck. If after reading the material you don't believe there's a problem, then Vermont may be the "Land of Oz" or at least the "perfect world" as Walgreens advertises.

When I'm approached about billing Farmers' for a windshield repair, I tell the customer, "no problem"; however that Farmers' or Safelite may tell them that we are not on "the list". I go on to say that they (the customer) will pay nothing to us, and that all of our work is guaranteed, in writing. I tell them that we may still have problems because Farmers prefers to use a chain owned by a company from out-of-state. (Here in Oklahoma City as well as Oklahoma, many prefer to deal with a locally-owned company.) I also say that they have the right to choose by law, who works on their vehicle and if they would like to see a copy, I will gladly show them. Also it is linked on our website. Further that I cannot say that they won't be punished for filing a claim, like I can for State Farm and Allstate. I finish by stating that if they would like to save money on their insurance and have future repairs paid for by an insurance company, that I will be happy to give them my independent agent's number and that they have told me that many times they have beaten Farmers' rates.

Finally I have never been told of anyone having their rates increased because of windshield repair claims. Yet I have many repeat customers and referrals that tell me to bill their insurance.

ARG

[GlassStarz]

If you read my statement I said most and generaly Im sure that the steer is attempted but lets face it if you are on the glass working when this happens its hard to get the customer to switch horses in mid stream. my close id simple I sell the customer on the free repair look at thier insurance card call ACT give them the customer details and number of chips and hand the phone to the customer and begin work its a couple minutes before they get to talk to someone from thier company and im well into the repair by then.
The cost to me should we find out that repair isnt covered is less than a buck in materials and a few minutes time WHO CARES? my point is simple a couple times as I worked I have heard the customer state to whoever they are talking to on the phone
" He had already started so that doesnt matter" In 3 years I have had 4 occassions where the repair wasnt covered and I didnt collect for the repair and never been pulled off the glass in mid repair because the customer wanted to use someone else. I do at least 15 insurance jobs a week some weeks like this last one over 30 all cold call all without the evil steer dont mean to hurt anyones feelings and certainly have a great deal of respect for many here but in my opinion the Steer is a easy objection to overcome

[ARG]

ACT does a fantastic job and in most cases they stop steering. However with three companies the work is much harder. Farmers of Oklahoma is by far the worst. One must wonder if someone is being paid under the table or if either Safelite or Farmers have invested in the other. Progressive and Geico have improved since the lawsuits have been filed.

If the steering were stopped and Safelite would go to a system like Lynx, life would be much better, even Safelite would make more money. You may ask how Safelite would make more money? Simple, look at all the repairs that rather than being filed due to the steering are paid in cash. Replacement numbers are declining due to repair. Calls coming into the networks for replacements should also be reduced due to rebalance. While insurance repairs may dry up due to the rebalance, at this point repairs are clearly a point growth.

ARG

[StarQuest]

There's a news artical I came across in Glassbytes.com the other day. It's titled NAGS-one month later, dated 4/14/05. Might give some of you an idea how safelite works the system and their everyday practice to still business from the independants. Check it out;)